Burnt Orange Report

Are y'all saying the same things about the Washington State Governors race? Dino Rossi won the final count by 261 votes and the state ordered recount by 42 votes. Ms. Gregoire still has not conceded, and the Dem. party wants to spend $800K for a hand recount. Local election officials(Dems)in King county fear having to do a hand recount of 900K votes, don't consider it very accurate. Gov. Locke is to leave office on 1/12/05, and they fear that any kind of hand count could take that long to do, and leave no time to transition the state government to the winner of that hand count.

Dino Rossi has been certified the Gov. elect by the state's election officer and Gov. Locke. So let the election-stealing begin as y'all say.

To continue above comment; it appears Senator Kerry endorses election-stealing. He gave $200K for the hand recount in Washington. So if Vo doesn't win blame Kerry. He supports this practice, as long as it helps Dems of course.

A couple things is response to Peter.

First, I agree with your point that the certified election should stand.

Second, John Kerry ended his campaign with $15 million unspent in his bank account, roughly the same amount he sucked out of Texas with reinvesting a single penny in our state elections. So a mere $200,000 to a candidate who endorsed him in a state he carried probably doesn't seem like that muich to him.

Third, the Andy Taylor-Talmadge Heflin power grab is happening right here in Texas, where BOR and the Texas Democratic Party reside. Washington has its own party, which will have to nswer for its own action or inaction.

Peter,

There's a big difference between requesting a recount and challenging an election result. Nobody disputes Heflin's right to ask for a recount -- any candidate who didn't with a result so close would be a fool.

The recount was finished yesterday and did not change the result. (One mail ballot that had been marked with a light pen that had been ruled an undervote was ruled a vote for Vo -- other than that, nothing changed.)

If Heflin wants the ballots counted again, and doesn't mind paying for it again, fine. I would suggest a big difference between Washington state and Harris County. I don't believe Washington is using electronic machines statewide. Therefore, you have a large number of ballots that may change in a manual recount. In Harris County, everything but the absentee ballots are done electronically. You can count those as many times as you want, it won't change the result, even by a vote.

Heflin is alleging "illegal voting" but has offered no specific evidence to support his charges. He has cherry-picked only predominantly minority precincts in the district for where the illegality is. That's a long way from just asking for a recount.

Heflin lost his race because he was out of touch with his district and couldn't even be bothered to campaign there. (He spent time campaigning in other districts instead of his own.)

Heflin lost and, as President Bush said in 2000, "it's time for the losers to go home." These days, Heflin's sounding a lot more like Al Gore. You lost Talmadge. Go home and quit whining.

Cletus, there's nothing you said thats any different than what Ms Gregoire is saying in Washington. She wishes to cherry pick which counties to recount and if the fishing is good, she will get the whole state recounted. The state has a combination of optical and punch, King County has a majority of punch machines, and thats where the majority of the vote problems are. The biggest county, the one with the most votes for Gregoire.

No difference between the two with the exception of number of votes. Ms. Gregoire need to do the same as Mr. Heflin. Go home

Peter,

Please understand the difference between the following two concepts: 1) requests for a recount 2) alledging illegal behavior.

In 2.5 million ballots, if a race is decided by 42 votes, I would want to use as many recount methods as possible to get the most accurate count. Again, asking for a recount is not undemocratic, unethical, or hypocritical. It is part of the process.

HOWEVER, in you would look towards Alief you will see an example of undemocratic, unethical, and hypotrical man in Talmadge Heflin via his lawyer Andy Taylor. Undemocratic in refusing to believe the person with the most votes wins (I know I wasn't around for the conception of the idea of democracy, but I think having more votes than the other guy is like part of the basic thesis). Unethical in the unfounded and wild accusations about illegal votes coming from District 149 against fellow Republican Beverly Kaufman (calling someone ethical to me means they are consistant in pressing for values, which brings us to . . . .). How hypocritical are these folks? Well, in the same week, they call for every vote being counted (absente ballots as well as military) and when the vote total still doesn't work for them, they bust out the a graph showing arrows from counties all across the state where the absente votes they requested be counted came from. But now, it is all part of a vast left-wing conspiracy of moving extra voters into the area.

So here are the values in this race, Pete:

Value A: Count every vote, and then have a recount, but before it is complete, move to value C. This way, you can be sure to come out ok even if voters don't elect you.

Value B: Criticize the process. Make it look like you are the victim despite every decision maker in the process coming from your own party.

Value C: Claim the votes you previously had wanted counted are now outsiders stealing an elections.

Values in Washington: count every vote (hand counts preferable).

Peter, if you can't see the difference between requesting recounts and alledging that Santa Claus, Mrs. Claus, along with the elves (who live OUTSIDE THE DISTRICT, the bastards) all cast absente illegal votes in the race, than you are living in a winter wonderland.

Red Dog, I'm for taking Vo's election as fact. I'm for taking Rossi's election as fact. Lets get moving forward from that. The elections over, move on.

NO election is 100% perfect! We've generally had 99.9% correct vote tabulations. Now someone comes along and wants 99.99% accuracy or 99.999% accuracy. Each time votes are counted, no matter which voting method is used, there is going to be errors. These machines(Computer included) have error rates, 3.3% on touch screens and 2.5% on punch cards. Error rates are from testimony given California Supreme Court during the recall of Grey Davis.

I trust that y'all in Austin counted the votes correctly, just like you trust that our election officials in Dallas count the vote correctly. I don't question the vote until someone proves something. I was very against the ALGORE abuse of the Florida court system. 70 trials completed in 5 weeks. There is freedom, and there is right. Spending so much time abusing the electorate by going thru the courts, is a practice that should very rarely be used.

These court challenges DO shake the electorates confidence in the vote. We need to build up this confidence, not tear it down. Y'all at BOR worked hard at getting people interested in this election (GOTV), I would hate, yes hate to see that be in vain. These court challenges have that result. People want to see the vote, find out the result, and move on. Not see it in the papers or on the news for weeks to come. We expect the vote to be right the first time. Everything else looks like sour grapes. I don't question the vote in New Hampshire or Wisconcin or NM or PA or Iowa or Ohio. The vote is the vote. Some went my way, some didn't.

I'd be proud to have Mr. Vo represent me, given his history, just like I'm proud to have our President in office.

This is not the Ukraine. Maybe simple but hey.

As for the Wash. State and Texas comparisons... I would challenge anyone here to look at my posts. I have consistently supported having a recount. I had no problem with Heflin, Opieda or Stick requesting a recount. I feel the same way about Gregoire in WA. Considering that the recount eliminated 80% of Rossi's lead, Gregoire certainly seems justified in asking for a full hand recount so long as she can pay for it.

If Heflin, Opieda and Stick want handrecounts now that they've lost the first recount, I say give it to them. Contesting the election is an entirely different matter, but Gregoire has not done that. There are not grounds for a contest in WA just as there is no grounds for any in Texas. That's my position, and i'm sticking to it.

Peter,

We can agree on one thing stated by Kelly Fero: Andy Taylor and Talmadge Heflin are the only two people who won't take Vo for an answer.

And for the record, the Red Dog does his dig'n in Houston.