5 Reasons Texas is Better Than OU

To answer your 5 reasons (0.00 / 0)

1.  No debate there -- Texas beat Oklahoma

2.  A loss is a loss -- no excuses.  Texas Tech beat Texas and has the same record as Texas (and Oklahoma).  If beating Oklahoma automatically lifts Texas, why should Texas Tech not receive the same benefit.  If they don't because of the lopsided loss to OU, why should that be held against OU -- after all, they delivered the demolishment.

3.  Last I checked, OSU could have stopped a simple running play through the line.  They did not.  In any case, I don't think a 13 point win vs. 20 point win is the end of the world.  And if does somehow matter, a 13 point win over OSU is still better than a 4 point win over OSU (see UT's win over OSU)  

4.  The idea is to pick the best teams THIS YEAR.  Who cares about the last five years?  If that is the criteria, why not go back 50 years.

5.  Repeating your 1st reason does not count as a reason.

Personally, as of right now, I think that Oklahoma and Texas should be in the BCS title game.  But that obviously is not going to happen.

And the winner of the Big 12 South should be careful of what they wish for.  Yes, either Texas or Oklahoma should beat Missouri solidly.  But neither would be the first team to see its National Title hopes go up in a conference championship game -- the Big 12 itself has a few examples.

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by: v2aggie2 @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 00:26:43 AM CST

Um (0.00 / 0)

2) Scheduling matters. Context matters. If context didn't matter, OU wouldn't be arguing that they are "the hot team right now" etc. etc. If Tech beat Texas in the first Big 12 game of the year, then Texas beat OU, Texas would be ahead of OU. Pretending that context doesn't matter is silly.

3) If you don't care about class, then you don't care about it. Nothing to discuss.

4) It matters to the BCS folks, who want good games that will bring in more ad money. It matters to the Big 12 as a league, that doesn't do well when it's "top team" routinely gets crushed in big games -- b/c that makes the whole league look weak (and leads to why everyone still assumes the SEC is the superior conference, which in turn has an effect on human pollsters, etc.). Going back more than four years is silly, too, b/c beyond that is an entirely new program. Today's seniors were recruited based on what was going on four years ago -- that's just common football sense.

5) It does if it's my list and I want to emphasize a point. If we want to say that Texas, OU, Florida, & Alabama are the top 4 teams in the country, then the semi-finals would be next week's SEC title game, and the Red River Rivalry game. The only way you disagree with that is if you say context matters...which refutes your argument on point 2.

I don't expect Texas to go ahead of OU. I expect Florida to crush OU in the title game, for UT & USC to have an awesome game that is much more exciting (and one where UT prevails), and for everyone to realize that "Big Game Bob" doesn't get his nickname back for beating Tech at home.

Now, a very great man once said that some people rob you with a fountain pen.

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by: Phillip Martin @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:12:58 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Well (0.00 / 0)

2.  A loss is a loss -- anything else is whining.  I'm sure Oklahoma has excuses for losing to Texas.  They don't matter either.  Texas Tech beat you. Face it.  Too bad there are no Texas Tech fans here to reinforce that point.

3.  Last I chected, class was not part of the BCS criteria.

4.  Again, it is about this year and who the 2 best teams are, not past results.  And both Oklahoma and Texas will be in BCS games.  If it is about TV ratings with regards to picking the 2 teams for the national championship game, then college football truly is a farce.  As for your top team getting beat, it should be noted that in 3 of those 4 years that you cite, Oklahoma won the Big 12.  Texas did not.  

5.  "It does if it it my list" -- Really?  That is your counterargument?  Whatever.

Finally, since you are so eager to criticize Oklahoma about its recent lack of success in big games, I remember an era not too long ago when Texas could not beat Oklahoma to save its life and couldn't win big games.  So what?

Again, that is not a criteria for the BCS.

As far as expectations for the BCS, there are still games next week.  Start looking ahead to the BCS games, and you will get a rude awakening.

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by: v2aggie2 @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:39:58 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I'm going to get a rude awakening? (0.00 / 0)

Am I playing in the games?

You're making this personal, when I'm not, so I'll step out. This isn't something that's important -- just a fun discussion I thought we could have. If folks aren't having fun with it and are getting aggressive, then there's no point in continuing the conversation on my end.

Feel free to talk crap back at me. It's a free public forum.

Now, a very great man once said that some people rob you with a fountain pen.

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by: Phillip Martin @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:54:15 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I didn't mean "you" Phillip (0.00 / 0)

I meant any team playing next week.  My point was that worrying about the BCS is a moot point if a team doesn't take care of business in the last weeks of the season, then they are done.

Last year was a very good example -- that is how LSU got to the title game

I did not mean anything personal.  Sorry I did not state it better.

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by: v2aggie2 @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 11:05:18 AM CST

[ Parent ]

It's all good (0.00 / 0)

We're having fun with this in a political forum. Actually I'm glad you started the thread to let us blow off some steam in a non-political thread. The past election and the upcoming ones keep us so hyped in an intellectual sense we need these kinda distractions. Glad you guys don't take this stuff seriously all the time.

BTW Phillip, you still chewing on that cabinet analysis? I know we had a good week of announcements and next week should be even better. Hillary on Monday right? Noriega, well we'll see. I haven't seen any more on him.

Okay, back to the BCS death march.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:09:40 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I'm still working on 3 campaigns (0.00 / 0)

so I'm still tightly wound!

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by: v2aggie2 @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 15:31:55 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I'm split on this one (5.00 / 1)

Both have good arguments except for the past five years argument. I side with v2aggie on this one. Squads change from year to year. These kids move on so the complexion of the squad will change each year in many cases. The only counter is that the coaches usually remain and build a system that should be accounted for. Look at basketball with Coach K and Bobby Knight.

Regarding everything but the Texas-OU game it's a toss-up and those darn "style points" factor in. I give OU the head on style but I also agree with Phillip on schedule. Texas had the toughest schedule make-up this year of any. They capped the schedule with a tight loss in Lubbock. OU demolished Tech in Norman. There is a big difference there.

Last night I started making up my mind with a comment Herbstreet made. He gives the series to Texas because of head to head. You can make the argument so many ways outside of that and you can come up with a gazillion scenarios that make sense. So in the end, use the head to head for your decision which gives it to Texas.

Now if only we were only voters on the Harris poll.  Let the BCS controversy continue another year. The playoff campaign will be starting shortly after the final poll.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 06:19:01 AM CST

Sagarin is out - OU ahead of Texas by .31 (0.00 / 0)

The first computer poll is out and OU leads Texas by .31. Florida, USC and Tech round out the next five. Alabama is in 6th and continues to make the writers and coaches look like fools after vaulting Alabama into 1st place. They can't fix the problem gracefully until the SEC championship.

The rest don't come out until the BCS so we'll see what happens this afternoon.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 09:30:01 AM CST

AP, USA Today and Allstate Fan are in (0.00 / 0)

AP has all but anointed Florida as the national champion, having Alabama in the way of them moving Florida into the #1 slot. They did it to themselves.

Fans are in the same pickle. It looks like it's going to come down to the computer rankings to decide who will match up against FL. Anybody seen white smoke from the BCS Vatican yet?

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:27:54 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Mack Brown said it best... (0.00 / 0)

Last night in his interview, Coach Brown said it best...."I will have a hard time next week explaining to my players, how Oklahoma and Missouri are playing in the Big 12 Championship, when we beat them both." Soundly I might add.

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by: ears1foru @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:05:16 AM CST

Well, I have no sympathy for any BCS conference team (0.00 / 0)

All of these teams make a lot of money out of this system that they created.  Everybody knew the rules going into the season using the system that they created.

As far as the Big 12 tiebreaker criteria, well Big 12 members -- including Texas -- did not seem to have a problem with (granted, it is the 5th tiebreaker).  The fact that Big 12 members included the BCS as a criteria indicates further acceptance of the rules.

So if Mack Brown needs an explanation, he can just say that Texas and BCS schools are adhering to the rules setup by systems that THEY created.

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by: v2aggie2 @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:51:50 AM CST

[ Parent ]

True that (0.00 / 0)

BCS is a victim or beneficiary of its own making. It drives the controversy through the Rube Goldberg system designed to pick the two best teams in the nation and the Miss Congenialities (that's the best explanation for the other bowls) that play in the other BCS bowls.

Unfortunately it will continue to pull in the bucks because the biggest conferences participate in it which always produce the top teams. Boise State was the anomaly last year and started people thinking. The trouble is they thought up until the National Championship game then they forgot.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:05:44 PM CST

[ Parent ]

You forgot the most important reason ... (0.00 / 0)

6. UT is in Austin, OU is in Norman. 'Nuff said.

Too weird to be a Texan, too Texan to live anywhere else.

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by: ernesttubb @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 10:41:19 AM CST

SMU and Rice (0.00 / 0)

UT and Tech may have more loyal fans, but SMU and Rice are better academically and produce more successful alumni. Shouldn't that be the true measure of success?

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by: DallasDavid @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:17:54 PM CST

Hey I'm game but for another bowl (0.00 / 0)

Wouldn't that be a cool bowl? The academic bowl with the matchup decided by the best combined SAT scores. Then we can bring them in for the brawn part of the game.

Heck, if Princeton can do it in basketball and make a decent showing in the NCAA why can't we have one in football?

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:25:22 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Academics? (5.00 / 1)

What kind of commie are you? You ain't from around here, are you? Them's fightin' words!

LettersFromTexas.com

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by: Harold Cook @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 14:27:51 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Let's just review the facts here (0.00 / 0)

Rice>UT>SMU>OU>Tech

As far as football goes
UT 11-1
OU 11-1
Tech 11-1
Rice 9-3
SMU 1-11

But SMU is the future home of the GWB Library.

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by: George @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 15:14:56 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Big 12 tie breakers (0.00 / 0)

Maybe we should be looking at the fact the Big 12 needs a better tie break system than simply relying on the BCS standings.

If you've got 3 teams with identical records in your division, you should be basing it off something more tangible. What that might be in this situation, who knows? The "I beat you, so I am better" situation does not work if Texas beat OU, Texas Tech beat Texas, and OU beat Texas Tech.

Maybe they start having conference tournaments instead of arbitrary title games? It would be a good step in the right direction toward a national tournament.

www.stonewalldemocratsofdentoncounty.org

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by: John McClelland @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 15:02:46 PM CST

Yea, that debates happening in a lot of boards (0.00 / 0)

Personally I think the Big 12 never thought they'd be in this situation. They have the championship game but this year had such a strong South Division that it caused the problems. I don't think we've every had this strong of a division in my memory. I'd prefer to have more South teams in the BCS but that can't happen.

They couldn't do anything at this point because that would seem like changing the rules in the middle of the game. Next year I hope they think of a better system.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 15:16:09 PM CST

[ Parent ]

other conference tie breakers (0.00 / 0)

Just to add to the woes of Texas...using the tie break scenarios of some other major conferences, Texas would have won them all.

http://collegefootball.rivals....


www.stonewalldemocratsofdentoncounty.org

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by: John McClelland @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 18:10:13 PM CST

[ Parent ]

OU takes the spot (0.00 / 0)

The poll is in, Texas was third. The margin was .13 points. Analysis on Fox now.

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by: RBearSAT @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 15:20:14 PM CST

The rules are the rules (5.00 / 1)

I like the other conferences' rules better than the Big 12's (especially since they all would have crowned Texas), but that doesn't matter. Whether it's football tiebreakers or political primaries vs. caucuses, you compete with the rules you've got. Change the rules for next year, but don't whine about this year.

OU goes to the Big 12 championship game, fair and square. (Go Mizzou)

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by: LSadun @ Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 20:58:53 PM CST

Yep and hopefully they change next year (0.00 / 0)

Yet another situation where the Big 12 has to look to other conferences to figure it out. The Big 12 commissioners are jokes and can't seem to figure out how to run a big time conference.

Hopefully next year they will get it down and have a better system in place. They look like the biggest fools this year.

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by: RBearSAT @ Mon Dec 01, 2008 at 06:32:17 AM CST

[ Parent ]

The commissioners answer to the schools (0.00 / 0)

who haven't seemed to mind their stewardship and agreed to the tiebreakers.

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by: v2aggie2 @ Mon Dec 01, 2008 at 20:42:51 PM CST

[ Parent ]

BCS Games (5.00 / 1)

1)  As of now, UT is ahead of Florida and is really ahead of Florida in the computer rankings.  (Thank God that AP no longer counts for squat in the BCS).  If Florida beats Alabama, the BCS title game could very well be UT against OU.  Given how weak the SEC has been this year that is slightly more likely than OU-Florida.

2)  If the BCS game is OU-Florida, UT can't play USC.  As the Pac-10 Champ, USC is locked into the Rose Bowl against the Big 10 Champ -- Penn State ( -- and the folks in Pasadena are ecstatic about getting their preferred match-up back for the first time in several years).

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by: tmess2 @ Mon Dec 01, 2008 at 18:39:06 PM CST