Home

About
- Who We Are
- Community Guidelines
- Right to Respond

Advertising on BOR
- Advertise on BOR
- Buy on all Texas Blogs

Advertisements

Search




Advanced Search


TX-10: LJD, KUT, and NAIS


by: MeanRachel

Fri Feb 15, 2008 at 01:38 AM CST


(Another perspective on the NAIS issue in the TX-10 race.   - promoted by Karl-Thomas Musselman)

Right here at BOR we have a great case study in "drive by blogging," where a small myth gets spun as truth, before being perpetuated into something uglier through irresponsible blogging.

Mark Duncan's attack today on Larry Joe Doherty is a great example. Instead of a responsible examination of the facts, the use of evidence, and a fair presentation of two opposing sides, a bunch of unfounded and unsupported claims are put forward as truth. While it may be fun to try take a whack at someone you don't like, it does readers no good to not practice a little due diligence before attacking someone.  

As an avid Larry Joe Doherty supporter & volunteer, I feel compelled to try to set the record straight.  Let's take a look at facts, and then go from there:

This whole squabble traces back to a simple little online bio of LJD over at KUT. In the middle of it was a claim that LJD supports an NAIS system, and that Dan Grant opposes it. At the time, there was no source to back this up. However, McBlogger picked up on this and ran with it.

Larry Joe's campaign contacted KUT, and asked them to back up on that, since he's against NAIS and there aren't any credible sources proving otherwise. So KUT corrected the bio and issued a retraction:

A spokesman for Mr. Doherty said the candidate is not in favor of the National Animal Identification System. An earlier version of his biography posted on this site reported that he supported the program. KUT regrets the error.
ADVERTISEMENT
Dan Grant, however, still used the original report to launch an attack on Larry Joe, the first real negative shot of the campaign. Here's what Dan claimed:

Brenham resident and ex-TV personality Larry Joe Doherty this week told KUT-FM radio that he agrees with Republican incumbent Mike McCaul that the federal government should be allowed to impose a controversial new animal identification system on Central Texas farmers and ranchers.

Talk about running with the ball. Where did he get that from? No wonder Larry Joe's campaign quickly issued a scathing statement:

"This is a fight against Michael McCaul and the failed policies of George Bush," stated Doherty. "That my primary opponent would attempt to claim that I've expressed any type of agreement with Michael McCaul about a program I oppose shows a total lack of seriousness when it comes to representing people."

Well that seemed simple: KUT got something wrong, they corrected it. Dan Grant took the original KUT piece and turned it into something it wasn't, attributed statements to Larry Joe that he never made, doing so with no good evidence to back himself up. Libelous if you ask me, but I'm no lawyer.  

Once KUT corrected their error, Dan Grant had to edit his press release to link to a blog post as his source instead of KUT. That's the equivalent of citing the White House but linking to a Wikipedia article about the West Wing TV show.  This is a Congressional race, right?

But here's where things get weird. In an transparent effort to further slander the LJD campaign, Capitol Annex started trying to fit the square peg into a round hole:

KUT got the statement off Doherty's website, although it is no longer there, either. Sources from KUT have confirmed to Capitol Annex that the station found the material about his support of NAIS on Doherty's website, but that his campaign called and requested they pull it. The station complied.

Does that make any sense? Why would KUT pull something they themselves call an error, all the while complaining to Vince that it was true all along? I give the KUT editors a little more credit, even if Vince doesn't. Wouldn't Dan Grant or McBlogger or somebody have been pointing this out long ago if it had supposedly been on Larry Joe's website, instead of waiting for KUT to put it up? Common sense says it's that something went wrong on KUT's end, it was corrected, and life goes on. If you Google this, you'll find bloggers obsessing about Larry Joe and NAIS, but no substance behind any of it. If there was anything to it, they would have been attacking Larry Joe long before yesterday. Instead, KUT is was the only source for this, and they ended up retracting it because it's not true. Dan Grant assumed it was based on an interview between Larry Joe and KUT. A candidate fit for office would have gotten his facts straight before launching an untrue attack on another Democrat (maybe he needs a bracelet that says "WWBOD?" - What would Barack Obama do?).

Is it any wonder Vince's big piece of "evidence" is an online comment left at the Statesman last year. You can cite an online comment made by one random person, who offers no source backing up his comment, as a source? There are so many unsources here, my head is spinning.  Maybe there's no better evidence because . . . there never was any.

KUT messed up. They fixed it. Dan Grant smelled an opportunity, but didn't get his ducks in a row before going negative on Larry Joe. It blew up in his face, and now his campaign is looking like amateur hour.

I'm disappointed in the Dan Grant campaign for continuing to promote libelous statements on his website about Larry Joe.  It's also shameful that a couple of bloggers then use nasty attacks to try and perpetuate a smear and a lie, and the best "evidence" they can give is an unattributable online comment. That's bad for bloggers' credibility, and it doesn't do our audience any good. It's immature and it's amateurish and frankly, it's just wrong.

Bloggers, don't abuse your sway.  I suspect that the general readership here has already made up their minds one way or another as to whom they will support in the TX-10 race on March 4th.  However, bloggers still have the opportunity to reach undecided and swing voters and those voters deserve respect.  Readers want something productive and concrete, not something unfounded and incorrect.  Bloggers:  respect the readers and the candidates enough to perpetuate truth -- not lies.

Tags: , , , , , (All Tags)
Print Friendly View Send As Email
Here's a fact (5.00 / 1)
In July of last year, in a semi-public online venue to which the Doherty campaign has access, a member posted about a meeting he'd had with Mr. Doherty. At that time, it was very very clear to the poster that Mr. Doherty did not oppose NAIS.

The Doherty campaign did not correct the record at that time, and, indeed, has had eight months or so to correct the apparent misconception at least one group of online activists has about Mr. Doherty's position on NAIS.


Hrm. Well. Search is my friend (3.00 / 1)
My apologies to the Doherty campaign. Sigh. I did find a response wherein Mr. Doherty said that his position on NAIS mentioned above was a "mischaracterization" and "not accurate." At that time, he had not taken a position on NAIS.

I will say that while Dan Grant has come out forcefully against NAIS, Larry Joe Doherty's position on NAIS has been somewhat inscrutable, as, best as I can tell, he's not directly addressed the issue in any substantive way.

For us urbanites, it's not big deal, but to those in the rural counties between Austin and Houston, it's a really really big deal.


[ Parent ]
NAIS will have an impact on urbanites, too! (3.00 / 1)
For us urbanites, it's not big deal, but to those in the rural counties between Austin and Houston, it's a really really big deal.

The only people NAIS won't impact are vegetarians. There hasn't been a single cost analysis done of this program. That said, I know that it will cost $70/head to "chip" my 15 horses.

NAIS will require every single head of livestock to be entered into a database and tracked from birth to slaughter. What we're talking about is a new branch of government that will make FEMA and the Dept. of Agriculture seem miniscule from a budgetary standpoint. Who will pay for this? TAX PAYERS.

The cost on live-stock producers will be significant. What will this do to the price of meat, pork, poultry, etc. in the grocery store? Prices will go up to absorb the costs. Who will this impact? CONSUMERS.

So, just because you live in an urban area, don't think that NAIS won't have any impact on you.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Link? Source? (0.00 / 0)
Myself and others, I'm sure, would be interested in knowing more specifics. "Semi-public online venue?" "Poster?"  What and who are we talking about?

If this has been sitting around for 8 months, why is Dan Grant just now issuing a press release as if it is news?


Semi-public (3.00 / 1)
A) See my followup above.

2) The venue in question is the "True Blue 10" google group. It's semi public in that one can subscribe, and view the archives. Non-subscribers can't.

http://groups.google.com/group...


[ Parent ]
Thanks for clarifying. (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
He also said it when he... (4.00 / 2)
came to Keep Austin Blue in July. I remember it very clearly as do others. As for the True Blue 10 thing, that was an email floating around for a while. I don't know if anyone has a copy of it or not.

KUT didn't mess up... they pulled it straight off the mans website. Call them, they'll tell you the same thing. And I don't think they'd make it up out of the blue any more than I would.

Attacking Dan isn't going to help fix anything. Dan's didn't hack into Doherty's website and put up that statement. If Doherty wants someone to blame, he should look into a mirror.

As for why it wasn't caught sooner, I don't go to KUT that often. Sorry.


[ Parent ]
I don't think KUT made it up. (0.00 / 0)
I think KUT made an honest mistake, or at least I'd like to hope so.  Since there is so much speculation about it already, they probably just made a false assumption.

However, I just don't get how if it was up on LJD's website all this time, as you say it was, why Dan Grant waited until the KUT bio to jump on it.


[ Parent ]
I don't know... (3.00 / 1)
it could be that he doesn't visit it that often. I don't think I've ever been there.

Honestly, I'm supporting Dan as you know. It doesn't mean I dislike Larry Joe, I just don't think he's the right person to beat McCaul. And yes, his support for NAIS played a part in it. I'm glad he's come to Jesus on this issue, however, I'd rather vote for the guy who has been against it the whole time.

 


[ Parent ]
Could it be that Dan wanted to focus on McCaul? N/T (0.00 / 0)


"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[ Parent ]
You posted on the article at "Capitol Annex"... (0.00 / 0)
...where it was well-documented that the information that KUT used came for DOHERTY'S web site...That said, you know (not think) KUT didn't make it up!

Darn internets are going to get Mr. Doherty in a lot of trouble if he can't be consistent... or at least forthright.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
I spoke with.... (0.00 / 0)
...Sam at KUT. She advised that they found the statement on Larry Joe's website, period.  

Vince Leibowitz

[ Parent ]
I have intimate knowledge of this issue... (3.00 / 1)
...and Mr. Doherty's response (or rather lack thereof) is one of the reasons I feel he is not suited to represent the rural, livestock-owning constituents between Travis and Harris Counties).

This all started at a meeting of the Austin County Democrats (a rural county club), where I asked Mr. Doherty about NAIS. His response was that he had never heard of it.

CHRONOLOGY:

June 26 (Tuesday) Larry Joe spoke to the AC Dem. Club. I asked him about NAIS in the Q&A. He had never heard of the program. After the meeting, I volunteered to send him information (the conversation included Larry Joe, his wife Joanne, another AC Dem Club member and me).
June 27 I sent Larry Joe an e-mail with information on the program, links and the contact information for Judith McGeary of FARFA.
June 28 I received a 2 sentence "thank you" from Mr. Doherty's wife.

"Thanks, David.  Larry Joe has been on the road the last several days meeting people.  When he has had a chance to digest this, he can respond. Joanne"

I never heard another word from either of the Doherty's.

What it seems this boils down to is the rocky start Mr. Doherty got off to with both rural constituents and the net/grass roots.

The whole NAIS issue is only tangentially related to TrueBlue 10, which remains a great candidate neutral organization, but since it's being referenced in the comments, I'm including it.

When this issue was devoloping, I was a board member of TB10 (I have since tendered my resignation). As such, I was trying to maintain neutrality and was actually trying to get Mr. Doherty to get involved with our district-wide organization that could be invaluable to him. To my recollection, he's never participated, personally, in a single TB10 meeting. For the sake of full disclosure, his wife and campaign staffers have participated in some of the meetings.

After considering the situation for several days, I sent the following e-mail to the "core" group (those most active) in TB10 because there were issues regarding Mr. Doherty that I felt needed to be addressed (at the time, for the benefit of his campaign!). I've included the full-text of the e-mail so that the full breadth of the issue is "on the table". The emphasis in the following e-mail was in the original.

"From: David M. Greer
To: Cabinet TB10
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 7:40 PM
Subject: [tb10-cabinet] I have been wrestling with this...

I take my position on the board of TB10 with a great deal of responsibility. I also think that it is imperative to not show partiality to one candidate over the other. However, having said that, I think that Mr. Doherty's mindset regarding TB10 is troubling, at best.

Larry Joe spoke at the Austin County Democratic meeting last Tuesday.

After our meeting, I encouraged Larry Joe (privately) to participate ACTIVELY in TB10. I said that Dan had gotten plenty of face time and we are very aware of his positions and are getting to know him on a personal basis. Furthermore, TB10 isn't going to endorse a primary candidate but individuals will start forming opinions based on exposure.

His response: "WELL, IF THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES TO GET TB10 BEHIND ME, THEN PERHAPS I'M THE WRONG GUY FOR TB10". This is as close to an exact quote as I can come but I'm only off a word or two from a direct quote.

I was flabbergasted.

I think he has the impression that he only has to treat those he perceives as having positions of power as being worthy of his time/attention. He has a penchant for dropping names and reminding people of his connections and service on the SDEC.

He also remarked during his address to the Austin County Democratic Club meeting that "you're probably not going to like it but 60% of the vote is in Austin. So, I'm going to have to spend most of my time there and rely on district-wide support without me being able to be at all of the events outside of Austin." Those of us that are politically active outside our rural communities understand this reality, but the rank-and-file, average Austin County Club member isn't necessarily that sophisticated. Especially when we've had the experience of Ted Ankrum and Lorenzo before him who both treated us as valuable assets to their respective campaigns.

He was not aware that one of the proposed routes of the TTC is parallel to Hwy 69 (right through Austin County and 1 county away from his home county) and he didn't even know what NAIS was. I offered to get him up to speed on NAIS, as that was my "hot button" issue for Austin County during the last elections. I sent him information and links on Wednesday (the day after the meeting). I received a "thank you" from his wife on Thursday with a note saying, "You'll be hearing from Larry Joe when he's back in town." This has been almost a week ago but I have no reason to believe that he will ever respond to me. I e-mailed and asked him for a bio and photo to include on the Austin County Democratic Party web site the week he announced. I have yet to get one from him. After the Club meeting, he said to the Club's VP, "why don't you just send him what you wrote up about me". If I were running for office, I would certainly try to find out if the audience I was speaking to had any unique issues. That's just Public Speaking 101 (I was a Communications/Theatre major in university).

Suffice it to say that I am grossly under whelmed... and I haven't even gone into the over-the-top persona from his television show and web site. At our meeting, he was in a western blazer, white shirt, jeans and boots topped off by an American flag tie and straw hat. If I'm put off by this appearance, imagine what the Republican machine is going to do to him...Not to mention that he's got Mattress Mac for a campaign treasurer (those of you not in the Houston television market can't appreciate this)."

Mr. Doherty is showing a pattern of behaviour where instead of addressing his statements or issues, he instead chooses to attack the messenger. I have experienced Mr. Doherty's disdain, as well. It's interesting how it has come back to me from multiple sources, that Mr. Doherty has said vindictive and nasty things about me, personally when he's engaged in conversations with people that might know me.

It's sad that we can't stay above the fray and keep this about issues. I have been very hesitant to be completely explicit about my experience with Mr. Doherty, but this was the last straw.

Our two Democratic candidates may have very similar policies on the issues (with the exception of NAIS, and I stand behind this statement). Where the differentiation is drawn is in character.

Mr. Doherty, or his supporters, attack either his primary candidate or his supporters anytime they disagree with Mr. Doherty.

There's a pattern here. When I expressed concern about his "projected image" and how that would be used against him in the general election, his "Judge Larry Joe" site was taken down and scrubbed. (Unfortunately, I didn't save a cached version of that site). When questioned about his comments to another member of TB10, early in his campaign, he impugned the character of that individual by saying he had made false statments and "mischaracterized" what he had said. Now, when confronted with his support of NAIS, he uses the same tactic: a supporter attacks Mr. Grant and the campaign has his remarks removed from the KUT posting.



"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
I'm not attacking anyone. (0.00 / 0)
I'm questioning.  Since when is a supporter not allowed to offer a counterpoint?  Isn't that the purport of this forum?    

And I don't see how KUT taking down incorrect information from their website is a "tactic."

Our two Democratic candidates may have very similar policies on the issues (with the exception of NAIS, and I stand behind this statement).

You failed to mention that the candidates differ on the issue of Iraq (immediate v. slow withdrawal from a civil war that's gone on for hundreds of years and will continue to go on long after we leave, if that day ever comes).


At our meeting, he was in a western blazer, white shirt, jeans and boots topped off by an American flag tie and straw hat.

Seriously?  This isn't an episode of Gossip Girls, Liberaldem.  Let's get back to the issues.

Where the differentiation is drawn is in character.

You're entitled to your own character evaluations as you see fit.  I think this week's actions reflect a pretty poor character on Grant's part.


[ Parent ]
Gossip Girls! That's a good one! (0.00 / 0)
If you'll read my entire post, I said that I was going to copy the entire text of my e-mail to the core group of TB10 based on the events at the Austin County Dem. meeting, which showed not only naivete but ignorance (complete lack of knowledge of NAIS and TTC69 on Doherty's part, at that time) on core issues relevant to rural constituents. From there, he went on to say, in effect, that those were relevant issues to rural constituents but he doesn't have time for us because the votes are in Austin (the city, not the county).

Oh, furthermore, the Austin County Dems had a "candidate forum" a few weeks ago and invited all the candidates.

Dan participated, personally.

Larry Joe, with his extensive campaign staff not only couldn't send a surrogate, he couldn't even have a staffer send a "thank you, but we can't make it" e-mail. Courtesy doesn't seem to be his strong suit, either.

I'm questioning.  Since when is a supporter not allowed to offer a counterpoint?  

Counterpoint and respectful debate is good. Using inflammatory name-calling like "Gossip Girls", isn't productive and does nothing to further respectful discourse...especially since "dave" is part of my screen name and my full name is in the e-mail I posted above... Maybe a more apropos epithet would be "Ballistic Boy".

Your tone is no less partisan than mine.

Questioning is good. I just don't like the answers I'm getting (or the rushing sound of crickets when I ask for a position from the candidate). I'm not so full of self-importance as to think that I deserve a "personal" response, but don't you think that we've waited long enough for Doherty to answer rural constituent's concerns that were posed to him in a public forum? It's only been 8 months.

Let's not make this personal about you and me, ok? Let's make it about the differences between Dan and Larry Joe.

An "immediate withdrawal" in Iraq would cause disastrous events, not to mention lead to the deaths of thousands of innocent civilians (both Iraqi and US Embassy staff). Another of the reasons that Larry Joe isn't the right choice for me...but this diary is about NAIS.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
My apologies, Dave. (0.00 / 0)
Not trying to make it personal.  But I hear people start critiquing people's wardrobes in copious detail and it reminds me of a Babysitter's Club book.

I'm not so full of self-importance as to think that I deserve a "personal" response, but don't you think that we've waited long enough for Doherty to answer rural constituent's concerns that were posed to him in a public forum? It's only been 8 months.

Agreed.  You deserve an answer from him.  

I'd also like to know Dan Grant's position on health care but to take words from the Austin Chronicle's dual endorsement of LJD & DG, Grant appears to be "keeping his options open."

The difference is, I'm not going to hold it against the guy until makes up his mind.  I've frankly had enough of The Decider's shoot-from-the-hip ways, and am willing to give a candidate as much time as s/he needs to get the facts straight and consider all sides before they make an informed decision.

As for the rest about his attendance at candidate forums, etc. I can't really comment since I know nothing about his campaign schedules and whatnot.

I do know that became a LJD supporter because I went to a to a DFT forum back in November and saw him speak.  He was as angry as I feel about the state of the country.  He cares intensely about the environment.  He wants us out of Iraq now.  These are three things that are hugely important to me.


[ Parent ]
I just gave a basic description. (0.00 / 0)
copious detail

Furthermore, it was in the context of a greater issue. I don't like being pandered to and his "costume" came off as very disingenuous. As a person with a working horse farm, I can spot the real deal. That wasn't it.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
For what it's worth (3.00 / 1)
Larry Joe did attend at least one of the meetings of TB10 personally.  I think it was in April or May of 2007.

 

Disclosure: Former Political Director for Lee Leffingwell for Mayor of Austin ('09)


[ Parent ]
Thanks for the clarification!.... (3.00 / 1)
...that's why I didn't make it a definitive statement...I musta missed that meeting.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[ Parent ]
Re: Why it wasn't caught sooner (3.00 / 1)
McBloggler wrote:

As for why it wasn't caught sooner, I don't go to KUT that often. Sorry.

Well, that, and it appears to me that KUT doesn't allow robots to crawl their site, so a google alert wouldn't have picked up  the KUT posting.


Posted with Ted Ankrum's Permission (3.00 / 1)
On Jul 18 2007, 8:24 am, Ted Ankrum wrote:

Larry Doherty dropped by yesterday (Tue) for a meet and greet, along with his wife...For those of you in the in-between counties, I was very surprised to hear him say that if you oppose the NAIS, you simply don't know what is good for you, and that as a Congressman; this is something in which he would substitute his judgement for yours.

And here was Mr. Doherty's reply to the group:

Ted's statement about my "position" on NAIS is a complete mischaracterization of our discussion and is not accurate in any regard. I'm shocked that he took the liberty to speak for me...I have NOT decided anything about NAIS...I hope you will make up your mind about me based on the merits of what you see and hear first hand. I will take a reasoned stand on NAIS and make it known to you personally. If you have forwarded any part of this discussion outside of CD 10group, I'd appreciate your forwarding my response as well.     Larry Joe

Now, this is just my opinion, which is worth a wooden nickel, I'm sure:

I view Ted Ankrum as a man with immense personal integrity; this is based on some fairly extensive discussions with him at the 2005 (?) DemocracyFest in Austin. I also found Ted to be very articulate. So I find it curious that Ted would misunderstand what Mr. Doherty said so badly. And I don't believe Ted made up Mr. Doherty's position out of whole cloth.

But I wasn't there to hear what was said, and so it's a he said / he said issue.

So: as noted above, to the best of my knowledge, Larry Joe Doherty's position on NAIS isn't clear, nor has it been widely disseminated. Dan Grant's position against the program has been both clear and widely broadcast.


It's foolish to take a clear position when the issue itself isn't clear. (0.00 / 0)
As someone who rode horses professionally for six years while managing a stable of 47 horses, and who now works in the animal import/export industry, I have had quite a bit of information thrown at me about NAIS, despite the fact that I'm more of an urbanite and it otherwise would not affect me.

NAIS is a complicated, double-edged sword that to me has more to do with disease control than anything else.  Like most neonatal government programs, it's poorly put together and difficult for the average person to understand.  But if you've ever looked into regulations for other countries (such as the UK's DEFRA), it's amazing that our country is so unregulated when it comes to our live animals.  For me, there are still a lot of unanswered questions on the issue of NAIS that makes it hard for me to support it or to be against it.  I appreciate LJD's cautious approach on the issue -- I think there are some valid needs for a NAIS but some serious flaws in the program itself (not the least of which is its additional strain on small ranchers, for whom I think there should be some sort of financial assistance).

With that being said, whatever your stance on the issue, that's not what I'm here debating.  I'm just a little disappointed in Dan Grant's (whom I don't mind, I just prefer LJD) pigeonholing Larry Joe by saying that he agrees with McCaul on the issue of NAIS and then using bloggers to perpetuate the claims.  

And further to the point, in May 2006, an amendment was voted on that if passed, it would have stopped federal funding to NAIS.  Only three Democrats voted for it.  One hundred and ninety one Democrats voted against it, as did McCaul.  If you want to play the "S/he agrees with McCaul" game, Grant's got 191 more press releases to send out.  


[ Parent ]
Grant's not going to be running against 191 other people... (0.00 / 0)
...just McCaul.

Doherty's position is more clear than, I believe, you would like to think.

To also clarify your statement above, NAIS will actually do NOTHING to make the food supply any safer than it already is at this time. It is an "inventory" program that will benefit huge agribusinesses like CONAGRA. Small producers will be forced out of business because they can't compete financially.

A great deal of our meat is currently imported. NAIS will do nothing to make sure that meat is safe. COOL (Country of Origin Labeling) is what we should be working for, not NAIS. I'm much more comfortable eating a chicken or steak raised in the USA than I am a chicken imported from CHINA or beef from South America... The US hasn't experienced an outbreak of bird flue and there have been a total of 2 cases of mad cow in the USA (both were imported from Canada). Why created a multi-BILLION ANNUAL bureaucracy for a non-issue?

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
My statement wasn't about food safety. (0.00 / 0)
When I said "disease control" I was more referring to diseases which are passed from animal to animal.  EIA, flu-rhino, etc.

But you are right that we haven't experienced an outbreak.  Yet.  All of the other countries that have had the outbreaks are now scrambling like hell to implement better infrastructures.  What's so wrong with getting ahead of the curve, rather than waiting for something to go wrong and then playing catch-up?

Since we're going down this road (I really didn't intend start up an NAIS debate) I'd like to offer an example of some of the loopholes I see in the current regulations regarding avian influenza (bird flu).  If I want to import a parrot into the US from, let's say, Singapore, it must have a microchip (RFID) and that microchip must match the number on all of the documents and permit.  They swab it for AI and NCD upon arrival at the port of entry in the US and send the sample off for testing.  In the meantime, if it is a returning US-origin bird, it can go home or to wherever the bird will be staying.  If that bird does have AI, we'll find out the hard way once it's already been taken home and been exposed to other animals/humans/etc.  Granted the address of where the bird will be "quarantined" (not necessarily at one of the 3 government quarantine facilities in Miami, Chicago or New York) for 30 days is given to the USDA in case the bird does test positive.  But releasing a bird that has just been imported from overseas, with a likely stop in the EU or who knows where along the way depending on the routing, to the hands of an owner is just, to me, asking for trouble.

However, the alternative of that is if I want to send that same bird to Singapore from the US, the bird must be tested for AI and NCD within seven days of export and the original test results must accompany the bird to Singapore.  Upon arrival, the bird is scanned to show he does indeed have a microchip, cleared and released from their on-site quarantine station at the airport.  Singapore is certainly not the cornerstone of democracy, but they have the regulations in place to keep disease out.

I bring this up only to show that the US system for the shipments of live animals is by no means fool proof and while you would rather eat a chicken farmed in the US, that does not ensure the poultry has not been exposed to a foreign bird who might be carrying an infectious disease.

Just food for thought (pun intended) and somewhat sobering if you really start to think about it. I'm no fan of big government, especially given the ineptitude of the USDA on a whole, but there are some serious flaws in the current system.  It won't make my job any easier and certainly won't make me any more money if the CDC finally wakes up and figures this out (which they are starting to do). But for the sake of the safety of animals and the public, I'm open to the idea of "the mark of the beast" if it means we won't end up getting an outbreak of AI because some yay-hoo imports their infected bird from Singapore and the USDA drags their feet on tracking them down.


[ Parent ]
With your experience in import/export... (0.00 / 0)
If I want to import a parrot into the US from, let's say, Singapore, it must have a microchip (RFID) and that microchip must match the number on all of the documents and permit.

...isn't it true that the chipping and documenting of exotic bird imports has more to do with controlling poaching than animal health?


I bring this up only to show that the US system for the shipments of live animals is by no means fool proof and while you would rather eat a chicken farmed in the US, that does not ensure the poultry has not been exposed to a foreign bird who might be carrying an infectious disease.

No, it doesn't mean that a flock of chickens at a commercial farm might not come in contact with a "foreign" chicken. That said, I could get hit by a train crossing the railroad tracks, but the likelihood of that happening is almost an impossible likelihood.

The concept of NAIS isn't about the shipment, internationally, of live animals, either. The government and NAIS supporters are trying to frame it as a means of "food safety" in the domestic food supply. The various agri-businesses already have processes in place to address this.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Chipping is for accuracy and helps avoid fraudulent paperwork. (0.00 / 0)
It doesn't really have much to do with poaching.  Poaching is monitored by US Fish & Wildlife and an internationally recognized treaty called CITES (Convention on International Trade in Exotic Species).  There are varying "degrees" of CITES species (Appendix I, II and III), each one requiring more regulations and documentation depending on how endangered the exotic species is.  "Endangered" in this case meaning susceptible to poaching, not solely endangered of becoming extinct.  All parrots, which are often poached, are listed as CITES Appendix II species even though they are not all threatened by extinction.  In order to export a parrot from the US, you must obtain a CITES export permit through US FWS.  You must also get a CITES import permit from the other country you are going to.  This is done by giving a huge laundry list of details on where you obtained the bird, to include a band # or chip #, as well as the name of the breeder, etc.  There are only 3 kinds of birds that do not fall under CITES (the budgerigar aka "budgie," the cockatiel, and the peachfaced lovebird).  This is all well and good and CITES is a great international program that amazingly enough actually works and saves the lives of many animals.  

The CITES permit process is more about poaching - the AI & NCD testing upon arrival is to control disease.  I brought up import/export because you were talking about eating a chicken from China and I was trying to prove the point that with the current system, the US allows all sorts of imported animals to come in with hardly any disease testing and that your home grown food from America may not be as safe as you think.

However, the microchipping and the need for it that I see is because it is very simple to say that Bird X or Cow X has been tested for some disease, but unless you have it chipped with something that cannot be tampered with or altered, you can falsify documents and test results rather easily.

Anyway, you're right that NAIS doesn't directly affect import/export.  But, if we're getting around to my personal opinion on NAIS, which is not what my original post was about, I personally think any animal that is in the food supply chain should be chipped.  It is too easy for someone to change a tag or for a tag to be entered incorrectly. A microchip cannot be changed, cannot be lost (although it can malfunction on a very infrequent occasion) and cannot be fudged on official documents because at the end of the day, the scanner must match up with the chip number that's implanted in the animal.  

But this is just my opinion and I think we can just agree to disagree on this one.  If I get really concerned about the food supply, I'll just go vegetarian.


[ Parent ]
I'm really not trying to be contrarian just to be disagreeable. (0.00 / 0)
A microchip cannot be changed

I have been actively involved in the NAIS issue for several years now. RFID microchips can be "reprogrammed" without being removed and re-implanted.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
What about bar codes? (0.00 / 0)
You can't reprogram the bar code that comes with the chip number.

[ Parent ]
RFID CHIPS are only being discussed for horses... (0.00 / 0)
...at this time, because we show our animals and it meets an aesthetic requirement. All other livestock, at this time, will either be ear tagged or wing-banded.


"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[ Parent ]
Then why not just laser tat... (0.00 / 0)
the barcode?

This is all part of the problem... there's a traceback now that's pretty damn solid and has been for something like 100 years.  


[ Parent ]
Good point, McBlogger...but it still doesn't address... (0.00 / 0)
The fact that huge producers will be given a single "herd" ID (which will not account for every individual head). It also doesn't address the violation of property and civil rights by requiring those who own even one goat (think a poor kid that would like to show at the county fair) from having to register their property with the government and also report every time that animal leaves it's "point of origin" and travels to ANY place where it will be co-mingled with other livestock (county fair, horse show, veterinarian, et. al).

This program, ultimately, is not economically viable nor does it do anything to address the more important issues of animal health and humane treatment of livestock.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
In the cattle industry... (5.00 / 1)
it already exists. Producers are required by law to keep records and every head that goes through a sale barn can be traced back.

NAIS will not achieve any substantial or significant goal as Dave astutely points out.

As for why Congress passed this, you have a lobbyist from big ag in your office talking about protecting the food supply. You suddenly feel like you'll be a hero to your constituents if you do this. It's not until much later than you realize your constituents are pissed as hell.

As for your assertion about Grant 'using' bloggers, I have never cleared anything I post with any candidate and I never will.



[ Parent ]
Great point, McBlogger, and one that should be reiterated here. (0.00 / 0)
In the cattle industry...it already exists. Producers are required by law to keep records and every head that goes through a sale barn can be traced back.

So the subtext purpose of the program is to benefit giant agri-business and drive indepenedent producers either completely out of business or make them "contractors" to big agri-business.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Bingo... (5.00 / 1)
Hank Gilbert has a more colorful way of putting it, but that's the general idea.  

[ Parent ]
That would be Hank Gilbert... (0.00 / 0)
...Democratic candidate for TX Ag. Commissioner in the last election, who is also a strong opponent of NAIS.

In the credibility race, I would trust a cattleman's position on NAIS before I would believe a lawyer/television personality's shifting, ambiguous position on NAIS.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
The same Hank Gilbert... (0.00 / 0)
...that has ENDORSED Dan Grant.

What farm/livestock person or entity has endorsed Mr. Doherty?

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
How many of those 47 horses in the stable... (0.00 / 0)
were intended for human consumption?

How would NAIS prevent them getting a disease? Things like hoof and mouth can be carried and transmitted to livestock (intended for human consumption) by rodents, birds, dogs, coyotes, etc. NAIS won't work. There is nothing in the program that addresses disease prevention.

The beef industry and the poultry industry already have safeguards in place. Why create a multi-billion dollar branch of government that does nothing more than track animal movement and require law-abiding citizens to register their properties with the government?

I like LJD's positions on most of the issues, too. What I don't like is his methodology and his distorting facts by resorting to arguments of semantics. (His support of NAIS was on his web site at one time. FACT. His campaign finance manager held a fund raiser for Romney. FACT. His response was to vehemently deny the "rumor" that he was at the fund raiser.  I've never seen or heard that allegation, but Mr. Doherty uses it as a smokescreen to divert people's attention from the FACT.)

As Dukakis_in_a_tank points out down thread, this issue could be very easily resolved. As a self-professed Doherty supporter, why don't you ask him directly if he supports or opposes NAIS? Why not ask him if his position was on his web  site and then removed when it became "toxic"?

I might be in a very conflicted place about who I'm supporting if I didn't have 8 months of "history" with Mr. Doherty's tactics.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Then there was the following after Mr. Doherty replied: (3.00 / 1)
Since Ted granted permission for the above, I don't believe he would mind my posting his follow-up e-mail on the issue and meeting (I added a bold to Mr. Ankrum's comments about the real "issue" with NAIS, as it relates to rural constituents generally, and to me personally, as the owner of 15 horses:

I stand by my summary of Larry's remarks regarding NAIS.  In fact, they are close to verbatim quotes.  Ann was present.

Larry's right, I never asked him; because he didn't respond to a message left for him after key supporters in Washington county urged I follow up to their requests.

Larry asked why the people in the in-between counties were so opposed to NAIS.  I said it was because they thought the expense and time of complying with chipping and reporting every animal movement exceeded any benefit.  I told him that this was the "camel's nose under the tent" to turn independent beef producers into contract cattlemen for the agribusinesses pushing NAIS.  The cost and reporting burden will be so onerous that only a big business will be able to keep track in a cost-efficient way, and cattlemen will be forced into doing business the way chicken farmers now do--Purdue/Tyson, et.al. send chicks and feed to the farmer and pick up the "finished" chickens.  There is none of the independence that Texas cattlemen consider their birthright and the Agribusiness will "own" them.

This does not even touch on the other people affected, such as horse breeders; who will see no benefit.  The presentations I attended during the campaign made it clear that the NAIS really didn't address the mad cow disease problem, as I initially thought.  In fact, conversations with a State Ag official at one of the meetings made it clear that there are existing systems in place to achieve that end, and so I was asking myself why the Agribusiness were so strongly in favor of more government intervention in their business.  My opinion on the reason for this is above.

On a personal note, Ted Ankrum was initially pro-NAIS. I had the opportunity to discuss the issue with him further after the State Convention in Ft. Worth and express my concerns. The difference between Ted and Doherty was that Ted kept an open mind and didn't dig his heels in and become dismissive because a constituent disagreed with him.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
This can be easily resolved... (5.00 / 1)
I notice that in this post meanrachel continuously attacks the research methods of the questioned bloggers and the reasonableness of KUT's motivations.  One thing not defintiviely said is whether the piece was ever on the website.  So, I think someone from the LJD campaign should answer yes or no to the follwing question, "Has your website ever stated that LJD supported NAIS?"  Seems easy enough to me.  

Good point, Dukakis... (0.00 / 0)
It could be easily resolved...but if history's any barometer, it won't be answered.

As noted up thread, I've been waiting for Mr. Doherty to get back to the Austin County Democrats on his position on NAIS since JUNE 2007.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
The diary linked below: (0.00 / 0)
http://www.burntorangereport.c...

...renders this diary by "MeanRachel" irrelevant.

The
WHO
WHAT
and
WHERE

of the source of KUT's statement of Doherty's statement is legitimate....Some folks just don't like the answer.

What's even more disingenuous is that this diarist knew this before writing this hit piece. How do I know? Because she commented on the original story over at Capitol Annex that was posted two days ago.

LINKY: http://capitolannex.com/2008/0...


meanrachel { 02.14.08 at 3:55 pm }

   I'm all for blogs becoming influential in politics, but why is Dan Grant linking to this blog as the source for his press release, with the words "KUT reported" leading over here? Are you affiliated with KUT somehow? I'm just a bit confused, since your site says KUT took the statement down.

   The press release in question.

   It just seems a little unprofessional for a US Congressional candidate such as Grant to be using a local blog as his source. Shades of the Dawnna Dukes campaign.

   I thought that progressive candidates like Dan Grant were supposed to be above petty political divisiveness based on unfounded, sourceless falsities. Grant may be young and inexperienced, but that's no excuse for immaturity.

Oops. Darn internets and bloggers! Exposing facts...for shame (/snark)

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


That's right (0.00 / 0)
I did comment.  I was confused as to why the blogger was making statements about KUT and couldn't figure out why Dan Grant was saying KUT reported it but his website was linking to some blogger??  So I asked around and found out that they weren't at all affiliated with KUT.

So...I don't get what you're trying to say??


[ Parent ]
Forgive me if I'm being dense, MeanRachel... (0.00 / 0)
...but it was very clear to me after reading the article at Capitol Annex that KUT had gotten their information off of LJD's website. So I don't understand the point of your diary taking Dan to task for speaking the truth about his opponent's position on NAIS.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[ Parent ]
Right. (0.00 / 0)
Dan Grant did not speak the truth. He announced he thought was truth, was proven incorrect, and yet continues to link to a blog about nothing valid.

KUT apparently told someone (CapitolBlogger?) that they got the info off of LJD's website.  Except for that they didn't because it wasn't there.  They realized this when the LJD campaign called and told them so.  So they took the misinformation off their bio and said they regretted the error.  If I'm missing something here, please let me know.

Meanwhile, Dan Grant assumed that the information was given in an interview between LJD & KUT.  He issued a press release citing the KUT report, but then the source was made invalid by KUT's modification and so he changed the link on his press release to direct people to CapitolAnnex.

Hence the point of my entire post which is that Dan Grant linking back to CapitolAnnex who basically links to a random comment made at the Statesman that is unfounded and unsourced, is pretty amateur, IMO.


[ Parent ]
What part of this isn't accurate... (0.00 / 0)
...and do you have irrefutable proof?

My point is that Doherty uses "lawyer tactics" like saying he had not "stated in an interview that he supports NAIS". Does that mean that KUT didn't get that information from his web site? It's very possible to remove things from web sites that are then gone into the ether if someone doesn't have a saved cache page as evidence. (Just ask Mr. Doherty about his pre-candidate web site if you don't believe me)

http://www.burntorangereport.c...

Doherty's camp then called KUT, demanding they remove this, stating that Doherty had not stated in an interview that he supports NAIS.

When Vince noticed that KUT's story changed, he called in to investigate. KUT confirmed that when they were researching the story, Doherty's website stated that he supports NAIS. Here is Vince's story, and some highlights:

   

It appears as though Larry Joe Doherty (D-Brenham) is running away from a statements which were formerly on his website that enunciated his unequivocal support for NAIS-the National Animal Identification System.

   Via McBlogger, Austin station KUT-FM reported on Doherty's thoughts, which the station culled from his website:

   Doherty supports the National Animal Identification System. Opponents of the program claim it is designed to benefit major agricultural software campaign donors. His opponent, Mr. Grant, is fighting against it.

   Dan Grant (D-Austin), Doherty's opponent in the March 4 Democratic Primary, even released a statement in response to his opponent's position.

Later yesterday, Vince wrote another piece:

 

Late this afternoon, Doherty's camp issued a press release calling on fellow Democrat Dan Grant (D-Austin) to "apologize" for misrepresenting Doherty's position on the National Animal Identification System in the TX CD 10 race:

   This morning, KUT retracted an erroneous description of Doherty's position on a National Animal Identification System (NAIS).

   This is a lie and Doherty knows it. Capitol Annex called KUT and was advised that Doherty did in fact make the statement attributed to him. However, it was on his website and not in an interview, which he evidently never returned calls about conducting. The description not erroneous. It was on Doherty's website! While Doherty is correct in saying it wasn't in an interview, everything else is 100 percent false. Doherty is just trying to run from his support from NAIS.

Note: "Capitol Annex called KUT and was advised that Doherty did in fact make the statement attributed to him". Where is the denial from the Doherty campaign?

Note: "it was on his web site and not in an interview, which he evidently never returned calls about conducting". Where is the denial from the Doherty campaign?

If these things are patently false, why doesn't Doherty come forward and set the record straight himself? Is it beneath him to answer hard questions from constituents? If that's the case, then he isn't an acceptable alternative to McCaul, for me.

There are a lot of us in rural CD10 that would like to know the FACTS. Not parsed. Not filtered through semantics and legalspeak. Doherty claims to be a straight shooter. Well, I for one, am waiting. If he doesn't issue a statement, I'm not convinced.

So, Larry Joe, did you at one point support NAIS? Did you change your mind? If you did, that's a far different thing than saying you never held that position. Changing one's mind can be a sign of strength and growth.

I know for a fact that the Doherty camp would like me to just go away and shut up. Well, unfortunately, democracy doesn't work that way and I won't cowtow and lob softballs.  

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Again... (3.00 / 1)
Dan may have been inaccurate regarding the way KUT got the information, but the fact remains that they got it from a legit source.  

[ Parent ]
jesus. I want the last 10 minutes of my life back. (0.00 / 0)


Sorry you don't find this topic of interest... (0.00 / 0)
Will you subsidize my meat purchases if this program is implemented?

Too bad that neither you nor Larry Joe don't "get it" when it comes to this issue.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
The diarist keeps framing NAIS in a "testing" context... (0.00 / 0)
MeanRachel keeps talking about what other countries do, without recognizing that NAIS is not about testing for disease.  It's a tracking system that does nothing to increase detection of disease.  The USDA has opposed increased testing for Mad Cow, is planning to allow for imports from a country that has Foot & Mouth Disease, and says it doesn't have enough funding to inspect more than 1% of the imports.  

So how is an electronic tagging system going to help?

By itself, a tag in an animal's ear -- whether plastic, metal, or RFID -- does nothing for health or food safety.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


Tracking disease is important. (0.00 / 0)
You chip an animal.

Then you track it.

Animal gets sick?  You know where it is.

Seems simple to me.

My references to testing in other countries was in direct response to you bringing up eating animals from other countries, in a futile effort to point out to you that most other countries have better programs in place.  

But, you seem to think that your odds are better of getting hit by a train than an infectious disease coming into the US, which makes me wish I was able to think as positively as you.  I guess I just have absolutely zero faith in the USDA, having to deal with them on a daily basis.


[ Parent ]
Don't you think the USDA will have responsibility for NAIS? (0.00 / 0)
The USDA has opposed increased testing for Mad Cow, is planning to allow for imports from a country that has Foot & Mouth Disease, and says it doesn't have enough funding to inspect more than 1% of the imports.  

If they can only inspect 1% of imports, how in the world are they going to be able to manage a database of 10s of millions of animals and their every movement? At the end of the day, there is no practical or fiscally responsible means of implementing NAIS.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Absolutely. (0.00 / 0)
Which is why further up thread I said:

I think there are some valid needs for a NAIS but some serious flaws in the program itself (not the least of which is its additional strain on small ranchers, for whom I think there should be some sort of financial assistance).

I've mentioned what I see as valid needs and what I see as serious flaws.  I think we've beaten the dead EIA horse enough.  


[ Parent ]
Dave (1.00 / 2)
You really need to find something more productive to do with your time. You've been hacking at Larry Joe for over 8 months now. You've laid into him for all manner of things, from your dislike for his TV show to his ability to raise money to NAIS to God knows what else. You're willing to lash out at anbody and everybody who doesn't see things your way immediately. You don't like Larry Joe and you think Dan Grant walks on water. We get it. Unfortunately for you, 99% of the voters in District 10 aren't pulling the lever based on your petulance and shrill advocacy, and I doubt that this behavior from you and Trey "I don't shill for anyone except when I do" McAtee will win over any significant number of undecided voters in this race.

As I've said before, I think both Dan and Larry Joe are solid candidates and either would be a tremendous improvement over what we have now. I refuse to condemn either of them based on a single issue, but I will most certainly not cast my vote based on the strident town-crying of people who raise such ridiculous hackles about simple misunderstandings (or who don't even know what a push-poll is ;) If you guys want to carry on about stuff that doesn't amount to a hill of beans, by all means have at it. Some of us will choose to spend our time doing what actually needs to be done to get rid of shit-heels like Mike McCaul, without burning down the barn in the process.  Carry on a have a lovely weekend, fellas.  


Robert... (5.00 / 1)
We've had this discussion... exactly when have I been a shill for Dan? I'm merely reporting information on this race. The problem is, you're pretty solidly for LJD and can't stand anyone who points out that he has some pretty big flaws and is campaigning poorly. All you've ever done is rise up to attack myself or Dave personally over this race. Your credibility is NIL online.

The reality is that LJD and some of his supporters have outright LIED about Dan on multiple occasions, involving other folks. For instance, Dan DID work for the Kerry campaign, a fact confirmed by Copelin at the AAS. However, LJD and crew are STILL spreading that lie.

Robert, before you dare to call me a shill you better make damn sure you're really on the side of the angels.  


[ Parent ]
From the BOR user guide. (5.00 / 1)
Users who are bashing or attacking any other user on the site, especially authors of diaries and frontpage postings, will be warned and/or banned. Elected officials and candidates for public office are allowed a highed level of criticism as they are in the public domain (but that doesn't mean you can use inflammatory language against candidates).

Thanks, McBlogger, for responding to the above. As a TU, I could TR the personal attacks from Mr. Ryland, but that's counterproductive to discourse. Although the comment does fall into the TR realm, I chose to flag it as "unproductive".



"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


[ Parent ]
Hey (0.00 / 0)
Good use of our guidelines, and good use of discretion. I think Robert had a good point to make, and just made it in the not-best-way-possible.

Now, a very great man once said that some people rob you with a fountain pen.

[ Parent ]
More clarity on Dan's involvement with the Kerry campaign: (0.00 / 0)
The reality is that LJD and some of his supporters have outright LIED about Dan on multiple occasions, involving other folks. For instance, Dan DID work for the Kerry campaign, a fact confirmed by Copelin at the AAS. However, LJD and crew are STILL spreading that lie.

http://www.dangrantforcongress...
(emphasis added below)

I can gladly confirm that Dan Grant worked as an Afghanistan policy advisor for the John Kerry for President campaign from 2003 to 2004.

Dan contacted me in the summer of 2003 while still in Kabul, and offered to lend his analysis of events there to the John Kerry campaign. He contacted me a number of times, providing incisive analysis of events and thoughtful recommendations for next steps. In 2004 Dan returned to the United States, specifically to support our campaign's efforts. He continued to provide analysis of the Bush administration's policies in Afghanistan, and how best to move forward from our then-current efforts. He worked in this capacity for the foreign policy team of the Kerry campaign until its conclusion in November of 2004.

So, who is this "Rand Beers"?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R...

Rand Beers is a former American counterterrorism adviser who served on the National Security Council under U.S. Presidents Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush. He also served as Assistant Secretary of State for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs under both President Clinton and President George W. Bush. Beers resigned in protest from the NSC in March 2003, five days before commencement of the U.S. invasion of Iraq.

...and

After leaving his NSC position, Beers joined the presidential campaign of John Kerry, serving as the National Security Advisor to the Kerry-Edwards 2004 campaign[2]. He teaches a seminar in collaboration with Richard A. Clarke on national security issues at the Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University.


"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[ Parent ]
Oh drama. 'Angels'? (0.00 / 0)
Are you joking? I could care less about my 'credibility online', and nobody who's serious about returning Texas to the people cares about yours.
I have yet to choose a candidate in this race. I have problems with Larry Joe's campaign thus far and problems with Dan's as well. What's patently clear is that many of you can't abide criticism while you dish out one nonsensical attack after another here, and continue to hide behind your 'online credibility' when you get called on childish behavior and amateur politics. This kind of garbage benefits no one but Michael McCaul and the Republican Party. Your 'reality' is your own, built on your own dogmatic tests of liberal purity, while you sit stewing over how to discredit and defame anyone who doesn't see fit to march in lockstep with your positions and priorities. You can continue running headlong toward the cliff like a headless chicken if you want, but don't don't be surprised if most of the Democrats in this district or in Texas don't choose to follow you. I'm sorry it angers you that some of us refuse to base our vote on you and Dave's holy and irreproachable word. Do forgive us for straying from the flock.


[ Parent ]
Actually, NAIS... (5.00 / 1)
is a solid issue in the district that cuts across party lines. It's not a liberal purity test.


[ Parent ]
A glaring current issue... (0.00 / 0)
...that shows just how NAIS wouldn't have any impact on animal health.

Emphasis added:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

The U.S. Department of Agriculture on Sunday ordered the recall of 143 million pounds of beef from a Southern California slaughterhouse that is the subject of an animal-abuse investigation.

The recall will affect beef products dating to Feb. 1, 2006, that came from Chino-based Westland/Hallmark Meat Co., the federal agency said. The company provided meat to various federal programs.



How would a registration database have prevented this?
It wouldn't. Current procedures and laws should be enforced. Creating a new bureaucracy for "inventory management" and civil liberties infringing practices (property registration)do nothing for disease prevention or inspection integrity.

48-hour traceback wouldn't do a hill of beans for beef slaughtered in 2006, that's already in the food supply. Nor would 48-hour traceback in the unlikely event of an outbreak necessarily trace back to the origin of the outbreak. Many diseases can be spread from wildlife (deer, birds, etc.) or even domestic companions (dogs and cats) to livestock intended for human consumption.

NAIS is not the answer.

NAIS will actually be beneficial to large scale producers like the Westland/Hallmark Meat Co. in Chino, California because they will be able to obtain a single ID for the entire herd. It is the small-producer/livestock owner (who already treats his animals more ethically) who will be penalized.

Secretary of Agriculture Ed Schafer said his department has evidence that Westland did not routinely contact its veterinarian when cattle became non-ambulatory after passing inspection, violating health regulations.

Veterinarians (who stand to profit immensely from NAIS, so of course, they support it)and cattle inspectors will always turn a blind eye to the corporate mega-feedlots.

Again, NAIS is not the answer. The enforcement of existing livestock inspections, feed inspections and food safety practices should be our top priority...NOT creating a bureaucracy that does nothing in the realm of animal health/welfare.

"A time comes when silence is betrayal." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.


Connect With BOR
Your source for Texas politics.

On Facebook: BOR
On Twitter: @BOR
On the Go: Mobile App

Upcoming BOR Events

"Do I Look Illegal?"
Arizona GOP Debate Watch

Wednesday, February 22
6:00-9:00 p.m.
Angie's Restaurant
1307 E. 7th Street
RSVP on Facebook

Save The Date:
Super Tuesday Super Watch Party!
Tuesday, March 6
6:00-10:00 p.m.
Scholz Garten
1607 San Jacinto



Menu

Make a New Account

Username:

Password:



Forget your username or password?


Shared On Facebook

Advertisement

Best of Texas Left
- (Complete Directory)
- B & B
- Bay Area Houston
- Blue Bloggin
- Bluedaze
- Brains and Eggs
- Capitol Annex
- Collin County Democrats
- Collin County Observer
- Community Forum
- Dog Canyon
- Dos Centavos
- Easter Lemming Liberal
- Eye on Williamson County
- Feet to the Fire
- Grading Texas
- Greg's Opinion
- Grits for Breakfast
- Half Empty
- Houtopia
- In the Pink Texas
- Kiss My Big Blue Butt
- Letters from Texas
- McBlogger
- Mean Rachel
- Musings
- North Texas Liberal
- Off the Kuff
- Panhandle Truth Squad
- Para Justicia y Libertad!
- Pink Dome
- San Antonio Mayor
- South Texas Chisme
- StoudDemBlog
- Texas Clover Leaf
- Texas Kaos
- The Caucus Blog
- There..Already
- Three Wise Men
Best of Texas Right
- Blogs of War
- BlogHouston
- Boots and Sabers
- Lone Star Times
- Publius TX
- Rick Perry vs the World
- Safety for Dummies
- Slightly Rough
- Urban Grounds
Other Texas Reads
- Burka Blog
- D Magazine
- DOT Show
- Statesman Elections
- Strong Political Analysis
- Texas Monthly
- Texas Observer
- The Texas Blue
- Quorum Report Daily Buzz
Around Austin
- Austin Bloggers
- Austin Chronicle
- Austin Contrarian
- Austin Metblogs
- Austin on Two Wheels
- Austin Real Estate Blog
- Austin Statesman
- Austin Texas Bike Shit Stuff
- Austin Towers
- Austinist
- Capital MetroBlog
- Daily Texan
- Do512
- Downtown Austin Blog
- East Austinite
- Elise Hu
-
Flash Mob Austin
- Keep Austin Blue
- M1EK
- Travis County Democrats
- University Democrats
TX Progressive Orgs
- ACLU Legislative Blog
- Atticus Circle
- Criminal Justice Coalition
- Equality Texas
- NOW Texas
- PFAW Texas
- Public Citizen
- SEIU Texas
- Tejano Insider
- Texas AFT
- Texas HDCC
- Texas Watch
- TFN
- TSTA
- TSEU
- Texas Young Democrats
- United Ways of Texas
TX Elections/Returns
- TX Returns 1992-present
- TX Media/Candidate List

- Bexar County
- Collin County
- Dallas county
- Denton County
- El Paso County
- Fort Bend County
- Harris County
- Jefferson County
- Tarrant County
- Travis County

- CNN 1998 Returns
- CNN 2000 Returns
- CNN 2002 Returns
- CNN 2004 Returns
- CNN 2006 Returns
- CNN 2008 Returns
Traffic Ratings
- Alexa Rating
- Quantcast Ratings
-
Syndication

Powered by: SoapBlox